Yuri Ivanovich







INT: I'll ask you again that - I don't quite understand what you mean, "lowering down the contradictions". Well, let me ask you the question, and then you reply to it. What, overall, was the value of the intelligence that you and your colleagues wereable to gather for the Soviet leadership in the early years of the Cold War?

YM: Influence? You mean how this information influenced? That's what I say: they didn't destroy the war of words. At that time, you know, Russians were saying very bad things about British; British were saying very bad things about Russians, and all that kind of things, and the tension rised. But this information lowered down that tension. It didn't lower down British tension, but as far as Russian is concerned, certainly it lowered. It made people think twice before doing something. I don't know - I'm sorry... (Laughs) I didn't express it correctly, no?

INT: No, no, no, I think that's clear. No, no, I think that's clear now. What I would like you to say is that the information gathered did have a big influence...

YM: Yes, it did, it did.

INT: ... but I have said it, but I need you just to saythat, you see - that's the problem.

YM: Yes. Well, you see, of couthis information influenced the decision of the leadership of the Soviet Union greatly, greatly, because they've been, I think, the most trusted people, and they proved their true attitude to us. There were, of course, as always in intelligence societies, you know, everthinking, "Oh, there must be something, something there coup, cooking, you know - you've got to be careful..." That might be wrong. Such an attitude wasn't possible at that time, and at the level of those who used this information.

INT: And one final question then. Just to go back again, I'd like to ask you: how much information were you getting hold of in London? Was it just a small amount or a large amount?

YM: A large amount. (Pause) I... well, you know, it's quite a lot, you know, it's......something like packets. You've got to put it in a briefcase, or you've got to put it...... something here, and it... quite a lot, quite a lot.

INT: And this was on a daily basis, or...?

YM: Oh no, oh no, no, no. As a matter of fact, I've been meeting very rarely, and not with all of

them. Say, I've been meeting with Burgess, but I've been seeing... well, ask Blunt to do this or something like that, and prepare to this problem, and... or let him prepare suggestions as [to] how to do or how to use this situation or something like that, you know. But I do it as rarely as possible.