Attachment 1

  
For Official Use Only

Minutes of the Program Committee

Division of Biological and Medical Research Argonne National
Laboratory

The eleventh meeting of the Program Committee began at 10:15 a.m.
on January 12, 1951, at Site B.

Present:

A.M. Brues, Chairman
R.J. Hasterlik
L.D. Marinelli
F.C. McLean
J.E. Rose
R.E. Zirkle
E.L. Powers, Executive Secretary
R.L. Cardwell
J.S. Schubert (part time)


* * *

Reorganization of Research in Biology, Medicine and Radiological
Physics (See Minutes of 10/6/50, p. 4-23; and 1/5/51, p. 10-74.)

Dr. Brues noted that Dr. Schubert was invited to this meeting in
order to discuss with the members of the Program Committee the
Relationship of himself and his group to the research activities
of the Division of Biological and Medical Research and to the
service activities of the Health Services Division.  For Dr.
Schubert's benefit, Dr. Brues reviewed briefly the scope of the
reorganization plans as discussed in the last meeting.  He
recalled the general opinion that the Schubert group belonged
programmatically and administratively within the Division of
Biological and Medical Research, but that some responsibilities
toward the bioassay functions of the Health Services Division
should be maintained by the group.  In regard to Dr. Lawrence S.
Myers, Dr. Schubert said that he felt Dr. Myers could not be
satisfied with an entirely routine job, but that Myers would have
more (illegible) the future to develop analytical methods which
are needed for fecal analyses.  The development of these
analytical methods and the assistance Myers would give to the

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investigators in H3 analyses and to investigators dealing with
low levels of C14 would constitute an amount of research work
acceptable to Myers while allowing sufficient time for the
routine aspects of the bioassay services.  Accordingly, Schubert
agreed that Myers could be listed formally as devoting about 90
per cent of his time to bioassay and about 10 per cent to
research.  He agreed that it would continue to be necessary for
him to have frequent contact with Liyers and that he probably
would be the best liaison between bioassay services and the
Program Committee.  In order to formally recognize this
relationship, it was agreed that Dr. Schubert would be listed as
devoting approximately 10 percent of his time to distributed
services, being responsible to Dr. Hasterlik as Director of
Health Services for this portion of his time, and that the
remainder of his time would be spent under the authority of the
Division of Biological and Medical Research.  Dr. Schubert left
the meeting at this time.

There were several questions raised concerning the names of
research groups and several suggestions were incorporated into
the new listing.

Dr. McLean said that with the death of the Noyes Panel, there is
no laboratory group within the AEC which now recognizes formally
the need (illegible) thought on military and civilian defense
problems.  While he does not (illegible) that a special group
carrying such a name need be set up, it should be agreed that one
of the responsibilities of some group (e.g., Special Problems)
would be this type of problem.

Human Radium Studies
(See Minutes of 11/17/50, p. 8-59)

There was brief discussion concerning certain legal aspects of
the current study of toxicity of Ra in humans. One of the
questions being considered by the Legal Department of ANL is the
acquisition of bodies of persons known to have ingested Ra.  It
appears that a Superior Court order for exhumation with the
consent of the nearest relatives is all that is necessary to
obtain the bodies.  If there is no kin, a Supreme Court order is
needed.  Dr. McLean pointed out that a person, when placed in a
museum, is considered by the courts to be legally buried.  Dr.
Hasterlik could foresee no serious problems in obtaining
authority to exhume the bodies of the people of interest to the
Ra group.

Dr. Hasterlik said that one of the Ra patients, Mrs. K., is
becoming quite ill and it is likely that she will die in the near
future.  this patient is of particular interest because external
y ray measurements indicate a total Ra content of 2 (illegible)g. 
The usual experience has been that (illegible) symptoms are not
demonstrated by persons containing less than (illegible).  For
this reason, all other possible diagnoses must be carefully
(illegible) out, and to this end a biopsy on her foot is planned
for next week.

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Dr. Arnold, who has had no military experience, has requested of
his (illegible) a deferment to July 1, 1951, which marks the end
of his term (illegible) fellow.  He is investigating
autoradiographic means of locating (illegible) deposited in bone,
a subject of considerable interest to the (illegible) at the
present time in view of its concern with chronic effects
(illegible) radioactive elements.

Dr. Brues expressed the opinion that a move to retain Dr. Arnold
in the field in which he has been working for a year and a half
and for (illegible) has shown aptitude should be considered.

Dr. McLean said that it was his experience that Draft Boards
should be dealt with by persons other than the individual and
that the Army (illegible) be dealt with after a person has
enlisted.  He felt that the Army (illegible) show much more sympathy
for an appeal for the efficient (illegible) of a scientist or a
physician than the ordinary Draft Board is (illegible).  Mr. Marinelli
recalled General Cooney's appeal for referrals (illegible) minutes of
10/6/50, p. 4-21) and suggested that should all else fail, would
be recommended to him.

Dr. Looney, who is responsible for a large part of the
administration (illegible) the current studies on the metabolism and
toxicity of Ra in (illegible), is in the Organized Reserves of the U.S.
Navy. Up to (illegible) Commanding Officer has shown a willingness to
cooperate and has (illegible) him to remain with Argonne.  Dr. Brues
felt that a continuance (illegible) type of deferment should not be
expected and wondered if a more (illegible) policy emanating from a
higher level is not in order.  He expressed (illegible) that the
administration of the laboratory is not anxious to (illegible)
initiative in asking for assignment of military personnel on
(illegible) duty here at the Laboratory.  Dr. Brues said he would
attempt to (illegible) the mind of the Committee on Medical Sciences of
the Panel on (illegible) Aspects of Atomic Warfare, National Military
Establishment, (illegible) persons like Dr. Looney.

Concerning draft deferments in general, it was agreed that it
would be very wise for the Laboratory to have a paragraph on file
for each man writing a request for deferment, describing the
particular way in which he is contributing to the research of the
Laboratory.

Argonne Cancer Hospital

Dr. Hasterlik discussed briefly the research program of the
Argonne Cancer Hospital.  It is his understanding  that the
Argonne Laboratory is (illegible) to assist in the determination of 
the research program to be carried out in this installation, and he
requested members of the Program Committee to consider the kinds
of problems that are properly and most efficiently investigated
in it.  The program is to be discussed with (illegible), Director of
the Argonne Cancer Hospital and Dean of the Division of

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Biological Sciences, in the very near future, and Dr. Hasterlik
(illegible) to have some definite proposals ready for consideration. 
As parts (illegible) of a general discussion concerning the program,
it was pointed out that (illegible) current investigation of toxicity 
of Ra in human beings is an excellent example of the kind of
activity for which a hospital is needed and (illegible) for which the
Argonne Cancer Hospital is intended.  The Argonne Cancer Hospital
can reasonably be expected to provide the access to clinical
material needed by the Division in its cancer investigations and
(illegible) the hospital is the proper place for experiments involving
radioactivity in human beings.

Concerning the last subject, Mr. Marinelli asked if there is a
general policy concerning human experimentation.  Dr. McLean said
that the Advisory Committee of the Division of Biology and
Medicine of the AEC has been approached several times in the past
for a general policy and (illegible) refused to formulate one. 
Apparently, proposals for human experiments with radioactivity
will continue to be judged on an individual basis.

Toxicity Laboratory

At the present time, the Toxicity Laboratory has been supported
by the Division of Military Applications through the Division of
Biology and Medicine of the Commission.  Dr. McLean felt that
further support on this basis will be difficult and that it is
not likely the present contract which expires October 1, 1951,
will be renewed.  There are no indications as to what will happen
to the facilities nor to the persons employed by the Laboratory
after expiration of the present contract.  Dr. McLean listed
several possibilities -- 1.)  It may return to the (illegible) Corps 
as the type of laboratory it was during the last war, 2.) It may
retain an interest in radiation biology but be supported by one
of the Services.  For example, the Air Force which has a
considerable interest in the deleterious effects of radiation,
their prevention and therapy, has no facilities of its own and it
may be interested in acquiring one, 3.)  The Toxicity Laboratory
may continue to be occupied by military and civilian defense and
atomic warfare as an independent (illegible), or as a part of the
Argonne National Laboratory.

It is Dr. McLean's impression that a proposal to incorporate the
(illegible) Laboratory into Argonne Laboratory would not be unwelcome
in (illegible) quarters and that the facilities and certain of the
personnel may (illegible) on problems relating to civilian and military
defense (see minutes of 1/12/51, p. 11-80).  Dr. Powers said that
he doubted that the administration of the Laboratory would feel
kindly toward assuming responsibility for the physical plant on
the campus occupied by the Toxicity (illegible) because of the
Laboratory's current heroic effort to consolidate geographically.

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(illegible) of CP-3, the number which just makes possible lethal
exposures (illegible) in reasonable lengths of time.  Drs. Zirkle and
Vogel are to (illegible) Dr. McCorkle to settle design questions and 
it is likely that (illegible) source will finally become available to 
the Division.

Human Toxicity Tests

Jack Schubert's desire for a test in humans of the toxicity of
(illegible) acid was discussed.  The compound shows some promise as
a remover of deposited Be.  Obviously the Laboratory should not be
directly involved in this sort of testing program, and it is
suggested that perhaps some pharmaceutical house could be
persuaded to handle similar tests.  the Chairman said that he
would inquire of the Medical (illegible) of the Division of Biology
and Medicine, Atomic Energy Commission, (illegible).

Human Radium Problem

(illegible) patient referred to previously (see Minutes of 1/12/51,)
of particular interest because the low estimated radium content
(illegible) symptoms of radium poisoning demonstrated by her, underwent
a (illegible) last week.  Definite diagnosis of fibrosarcoma has been
made.  A (illegible) of the biopsy material has been sent to Dr. Robley
D. Evans for Ra228 determinations.  Dr. Hasterlik also reported
sending to the New Operations Office Information from the Barker
files concerning certain analyses which the U.S. Radium
Corporation had made at one time.

The other item was reported for the information of the Committee. 
The (illegible) who was interested in running a newspaper story of the
toxicity has been consulted.  this individual is an employee of
the State (illegible) Department and his motive in this instance was to
demonstrate how institutions are cooperating in scientific
research.  When the delicate (illegible) of this particular research
was explained to him, he agreed not to (illegible) publicity until such
time as Dr. Hasterlik thinks it proper.

Mesothorium

Correspondence between W.P. Norris and H. Deplanche of the Rare
Minerals and Metals Company, inc., 21 East 40th Street, New York
16, New York, resulted in their offering the Laboratory 8 to 10
mg Ra 228 (see minutes of 1/12/51, p. 11-81).  If the Laboratory
were willing to divide (illegible) to lots of 8 to 10 mgs, the 
Minerals Company would waive (illegible) the Ra228.  Otherwise the 
only Ra228 (mesothorium bromide) (illegible) from them at the present 
time is a tube of Ra28 No. T 162, which (illegible) on April 22, 1944
and measured last on February 17, 1950, as (ill) 69.1 mg Ra
equivalent.  The cost is $35.00 per mg ex-warehouse, (illegible) by 

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Mr. Wahl, namely 50 (illegible) per cubic meter of air as T2 or HT, is 
the (illegible) permissible level recommended by the International
commission on (illegible) Protection (See Nucleonics, February 1951,
pp. 70-74).  Mr. (illegible) pointed out that this figure differs
somewhat from that used by this laboratory at the present time as
the mpl for operations.  Allowing (illegible) per/week total dosage, 
23 (illegible)/mc3 is indicated.  Since an allowance for (illegible)
to other radiations must n=be made, 10% of this figure, or 2 uc/m3 
(illegible) is the mpl for Argonne operations.  the need for experiments 
on (illegible) and metabolism was briefly discussed.

Human Radium Studies

Dr. McLean told of the recently initiated conferences with
various (illegible) members of the division concerning the
decontamination of persons (illegible) radium.  This group will
continue as one of the study groups (illegible) described (See Minutes
of 10/20/50, Appendix I, pg. 5-28), Dr. (illegible) reported that his
recent examination of the files of the U.S. Corporation reveals
the disturbing information that beginning in (illegible) there was
rather free substitution of RdTh (Th228, T1/2 = 1.9 years) (illegible)
(Ra228) in the paints used for clock dials.  The th228 contents
from 2 to 25% of the total activity, indicating great difficulty
in (illegible) the original activity in a particular patient. 
furthermore, it (illegible) necessary now to appreciate Th 228 toxicity
in addition to that of (illegible).  It seems likely that the dial
painters will not constitute (illegible) of information concerning Ra
toxicity in humans.

Consultants

(illegible) announced the intention of the Division to contract with
(illegible) Ward Wainwright as a consultant.  Dr. Wainwright was
formerly (illegible). He is interested in radioautography and will
assist and (illegible) the division in this field.

Meeting adjourned at 11:30 a.m.

*  *  *

E.l. Powers
Executive Secretary

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